Revolutionizing Real Estate: How Opendoor is Simplifying Life’s Biggest Transitions with CMO David Corns

[00:00:01] [SPEAKER_01]: I think consumers appreciate when you're doing something original. No one set it hard waiting to be advertised too, so if you do something unique, it feels like he gets the positive guess the attention.

[00:00:16] [SPEAKER_00]: To thrive in a rapidly evolving landscape, brands must move in an ever-increasing piss.

[00:00:21] [SPEAKER_00]: I'm Matt Britain, founder and CEO of Suzy. Join me and key industry leaders as we dive deep into the shifting consumer trends within their industry.

[00:00:28] [SPEAKER_00]: Why it matters now and how you can keep up. Welcome to the Speed of Culture.

[00:00:38] [SPEAKER_00]: Today we're thrilled to welcome David Corns, Chief Marketing Officer at Open Door.

[00:00:42] [SPEAKER_00]: David oversees an expansive team responsible for marketing communications, one of the most innovative companies in the real estate sector.

[00:00:48] [SPEAKER_00]: David, so we need to see you thanks much for joining today.

[00:00:50] [SPEAKER_01]: Thanks for having me, Bob.

[00:00:52] [SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely. So I was looking at your background and you've obviously spent the majority of your career up until now

[00:00:58] [SPEAKER_00]: within Mass Navi-New and some of the most prolific agencies out there.

[00:01:02] [SPEAKER_00]: I saw particularly that you were working at Crispin Porter during its heyday in the early 2000s.

[00:01:08] [SPEAKER_00]: Tell me about your experience there and how working in the agency like that really at the top of its game.

[00:01:12] [SPEAKER_00]: Really kind of shaped you for the CMO world that you're in today.

[00:01:16] [SPEAKER_01]: Crispin was probably I've described it as one of the most foundational moments of my career.

[00:01:22] [SPEAKER_01]: Not only the people I got to work with and learn from and collaborate with but also some of the brands I worked on.

[00:01:30] [SPEAKER_01]: And in actual fact, it also helped me learn how to build teams because I was actually employee one in the UK

[00:01:36] [SPEAKER_01]: and we were building out Crispin Europe for the Burger King which was the client at the time.

[00:01:42] [SPEAKER_01]: And the success in the UK led me I then moved to Miami office and spent time in the Boulder office.

[00:01:48] [SPEAKER_01]: But I would say Crispin was almost like a PR agency that did advertising.

[00:01:54] [SPEAKER_01]: Ruffin we did was in service of getting in the new cycle.

[00:02:00] [SPEAKER_01]: So all of the creative concepts started with what's the headline we want to get and then we worked back from there.

[00:02:07] [SPEAKER_01]: And I think I use that day in and day out now and I think from being a Crispin, I kind of taken that forward into the CMO role.

[00:02:16] [SPEAKER_01]: And I'm like, how do you get more than you're paying for by frankly being more audacious with what you're saying and how you're going to market.

[00:02:23] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, although now nearly 20 years later not the day either of us because I worked with Crispin on Victory Secret Pink Business back then and that same time period.

[00:02:32] [SPEAKER_00]: But the world has changed because it used to be if you need it buzz especially in a pre-facebook world.

[00:02:38] [SPEAKER_00]: You need the traditional media or at least industry media to cover you. And now I find it a little bit less important.

[00:02:45] [SPEAKER_00]: I find PR in general a little less important. Have you think the notion of buzz and virology so to speak has been redefined in today's age?

[00:02:54] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I think we used to say in that period you needed to play to play rather than pay to play if you played it got picked up it got shared.

[00:03:04] [SPEAKER_01]: I think creativity always wins. So if you find a way to create it with the new tool set and the new toolbox you have to work with, you can cut through and get some buzz. I'll give you an example.

[00:03:17] [SPEAKER_01]: In February we got over $7 million worth of 3 PR impressions from doing something unexpected which was we knew our audience was big into football was watching the Super Bowl.

[00:03:32] [SPEAKER_01]: And so we decided how do we get attention during this time? Well the reality is if you sell with open door it's so simple certain fast you could do it during half time which meant there was an authentic way of us to insert ourselves into the game to say rather than watching usher.

[00:03:51] [SPEAKER_01]: You could sell your house to us. It's that simple and so during half time in the last Super Bowl we got live to a real consumers phone and they did a house tour and in the next break sold our house to us in less time than it took usher to perform.

[00:04:06] [SPEAKER_01]: And because the idea was audacious it got additional press also it was $7 million for a 30 second spot nationally in this macro economic climate and real estate that would not have been a good use of money.

[00:04:21] [SPEAKER_01]: So we did it only in Atlanta and Atlanta was the hardest place to sell it at the time.

[00:04:26] [SPEAKER_01]: You did the promotional either land it wasn't shown to people nationally exactly it just played in Atlanta. But the build up to it because it was audacious got a lot of PR the fact we did it got a lot of PR and our national aided awareness lifted by 8% after doing that so I think I was used to say I can make you a video I found guarantee you go viral but I think if you are creative and strategic with how you go to market.

[00:04:54] [SPEAKER_01]: I think consumers appreciate when you're doing something original no one set it home waiting to be advertised to so if you do something unique it feels like against the positive.

[00:05:07] [SPEAKER_00]: Right and I mean normally I think what brands used to do is essentially they would reinforce that unique selling proposition in the case of open door which we'll get into is you can transact really quickly.

[00:05:18] [SPEAKER_00]: They will just tell you you can do that and they cram that message down your throat with a 30 second spot and instead what you're doing is you're showing them you can do it and you're doing it in the form of engaging content so you're getting that same unique selling proposition across.

[00:05:32] [SPEAKER_00]: But you're doing so in a way to sort of built for the way that consumers essentially consume content today.

[00:05:39] [SPEAKER_01]: Exactly and there's a couple more examples too we realized last year given mortgage rates if you look at 2022 first half of 2022 it was the hottest housing market on record mortgage rates for 23% second half of 2022.

[00:05:55] [SPEAKER_01]: It was the coolest housing market in about four years.

[00:05:59] [SPEAKER_00]: It was the biggest increase in interest rates we've seen in modern history.

[00:06:02] [SPEAKER_01]: Exactly it went from two percent rates to seven percent rates rapidly which slowed the entire market down so last year looking at who is selling right now.

[00:06:12] [SPEAKER_01]: It became clear to us that 55 plus can sell they've got equity in their home and then usually moving to downsize because their kids have gone to college while they went to college years ago or left the house and they've been growing it off.

[00:06:27] [SPEAKER_01]: So with that idea of mine we went to UCLA and built a massive burns nest an empty burns nest and it basically had a sign that said it's okay for you to leave the nest too.

[00:06:38] [SPEAKER_01]: So now was an event in the moment it got 80,000 impressions on the day but of course we sent a camera crew there and we talked to real parents during parent visitation day about the emotions of moving and changing house now the kids have left.

[00:06:56] [SPEAKER_01]: And so great content that can then be packaged up and shared both on TV on social unamette. So we're always looking for ways to essentially kind of hack in the culture.

[00:07:09] [SPEAKER_01]: I think the other thing is real estate is such a traditional category. The business hasn't changed in a hundred years of how you interact with real estate.

[00:07:20] [SPEAKER_01]: So that gives us a lot of opportunity to kind of have fun in the space and have attention come our way which for a brand that is ascending its key because they're highly-added awareness.

[00:07:32] [SPEAKER_01]: The more people the now of open door, the more people that we use us.

[00:07:36] [SPEAKER_00]: So let's zoom out for a second for our audience who may have heard of open door but don't quite know what the company does and tell us from the CMOs mouth himself. What open door is what makes the company different and where it's going here in 2024.

[00:07:48] [SPEAKER_01]: So open door essentially brings certainty, simplicity and speed to real estate. So hundred year old category unchanged full of hassle, stress, costs, long time lines.

[00:08:04] [SPEAKER_01]: What we do, you enter your address into our site, you get an instant offer on your home. After answering a few questions and share it with some pictures, you get a final offer on your home.

[00:08:15] [SPEAKER_01]: What used to take months of stress and hassle is now done in days. So that's on the cell side. On the biceite if you're buying a home for open door, there's a two benefits.

[00:08:28] [SPEAKER_01]: One, you can self-tour a home, walk up with your cell phone and through our app, open the door, tour the house yourself.

[00:08:35] [SPEAKER_01]: If you like the house, there's essentially a buy it now but no Hagel price, press the button, the house is reserved for you.

[00:08:42] [SPEAKER_01]: And if something changes in your life and you actually need to move neighborhoods, we have a 90 day return policy meaning you can return the house within 90 days and get your money back just like returning a pair of jeans to a retail store.

[00:08:56] [SPEAKER_00]: Now, I'm an imagine if you're on the cell side that trade off for you getting this certainty and speed is perhaps you're not maximizing your outcome in terms of a cell price. What are those dynamics like for the seller?

[00:09:09] [SPEAKER_01]: It varies in seasonality but essentially we offer a price on the home and it's up to the consumer if they choose to take it, it gives them charm.

[00:09:18] [SPEAKER_01]: And in many cases, many consumers are extremely happy with the process and the offer. We have 80% NDS score net promoter score, meaning consumers that use open door are happy with the premium service they get for the offer they receive on their house.

[00:09:37] [SPEAKER_01]: And therefore share that with friends and family and so the business continues to grow.

[00:09:41] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, because on both sides of the transaction it's just not a fun experience. I mean, I often question why in this day and age do somebody who's buying a home and getting a mortgage for that matter need to feel so many forms.

[00:09:55] [SPEAKER_00]: When ultimately it should be able to be decided by an underwriter with a couple of data points and then all the fees that are involved and all the back and forth.

[00:10:04] [SPEAKER_00]: It just doesn't seem like it has to take that long and has to be so laborious and it seems very much like it's just a legacy industry that has not really evolved with the times.

[00:10:13] [SPEAKER_01]: Exactly. Selling your house is up there with one of the most stressful things as well as dealing with divorce and death in your family, one of the top five most stressful things.

[00:10:24] [SPEAKER_01]: And that was actually one of the things that drew me to open door is I felt like most categories had been transformed by digital and yes there's some digital brands in real estate, but the actual transaction of taking something complex and making it simple just hadn't happened.

[00:10:43] [SPEAKER_01]: You could do it with buying and selling cars you could do it with hotels you could do it with travel, but something so caught to our lives provide shelter.

[00:10:54] [SPEAKER_01]: It's a home you need places to live that remains complicated and stressful and it just doesn't need to be.

[00:11:01] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so you had mentioned David earlier just the macro economic factors and how they impact your messaging and obviously the business opportunity.

[00:11:08] [SPEAKER_00]: So obviously we are an a period of relatively prolonged higher interest rates nobody really knows what's going to happen.

[00:11:15] [SPEAKER_00]: It's come down a little bit, but it's still much higher than when we see it in quite some time.

[00:11:19] [SPEAKER_00]: How does this environment impact open doors business as a create more demand on one side or the other of the equation and does that impact your product roadmap and you're messaging at all moving forward?

[00:11:30] [SPEAKER_01]: This macro is a real good time to show certainty uncertainty people look for certainty and the fact that we can give you an essentially an offer in minutes.

[00:11:43] [SPEAKER_01]: Then can then be finalized in days after some simple questions provides great certainty in the unknown.

[00:11:50] [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I'm not an economist but many economists have said they don't expect interest rates to go down as low as 2 and 3%.

[00:11:58] [SPEAKER_01]: So I think the reality is people will get used to interest rate and actually when you look historically 6% 7% is still relatively low.

[00:12:11] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, we're in the mid to high change in the 80s right exactly and I think even at a tough macro economic climate.

[00:12:18] [SPEAKER_01]: We have possibility to grow the pie might be smaller because less people are moving or slow to move but our ability to grow our share of that still increases because the reality is people move because they have a life transition.

[00:12:34] [SPEAKER_01]: They're having a baby, they're getting married and want to move in together.

[00:12:38] [SPEAKER_01]: They've got a dog and need a bigger yard, the kids have gone to college.

[00:12:42] [SPEAKER_01]: Life will continue to happen and people will continue to need to progress in life and open door is there for them to make that.

[00:12:50] [SPEAKER_01]: Currently stressful process of selling to progress in life simple and certain.

[00:12:57] [SPEAKER_00]: We'll be right back with the speed of culture after a few words from our sponsors.

[00:13:00] [SPEAKER_00]: So I'm curious to hear from you, I mean you're the CMO of a brand that's publicly traded company and obviously is very much reinventing the space in the category.

[00:13:10] [SPEAKER_00]: It's not like you're working at Coca-Cola and left from Pepsi where you're basically still selling carbonated beverages.

[00:13:16] [SPEAKER_00]: This is a completely new business model that comes with a lot of opportunities and a lot of risks as well.

[00:13:22] [SPEAKER_00]: What's it like being the CMO of a company like Open Door?

[00:13:24] [SPEAKER_00]: Where's your normal day look like and how you interacting with the various other stakeholders with the New Organization?

[00:13:31] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, well I joined Open Door in 2022 which was a year like no other.

[00:13:36] [SPEAKER_01]: I got to see the first half of the year, the hottest market.

[00:13:40] [SPEAKER_01]: I got to see in the second half of the year interest rates going up at a rate we've never seen before.

[00:13:45] [SPEAKER_01]: So that for a first year was both terrifying and exhilarating but allowed us to kind of pressure check what it is the hypothesis I had for what the company needed,

[00:13:59] [SPEAKER_01]: which was great product, great people, but there wasn't yet a brand or understanding of what Open Door is.

[00:14:05] [SPEAKER_01]: So we took here's an opportunity to step back. We created a purpose which is Paralympic, progress one over at a time.

[00:14:13] [SPEAKER_01]: Our mission is to transform US real estate industry which is a $2.3 trillion a year industry and then we took that to market by taking what we had was a brilliant performance marketing or

[00:14:27] [SPEAKER_01]: and building a full funnel and brand marketing or. And we saw almost immediately when we were telling these stories of live transitions our first campaign be open was all about that.

[00:14:40] [SPEAKER_01]: We saw a 10% increase in offers versus businesses usual and we saw awareness moving up pretty rapidly. So that actually gave us the confidence to kind of continue on that path of both brand building and delivering performance.

[00:14:56] [SPEAKER_01]: So as you say working with other stakeholders in the organization, one of the most fulfilling things in doing that was building a team that could bring some science to our art.

[00:15:10] [SPEAKER_01]: So working with the Chief Data Officer we built a marketing sciences fork.

[00:15:15] [SPEAKER_01]: So essentially new as every attribution model is broken so you just got to find which is least broken. Our attribution model was definitely biased towards lower funnel last touch attribution.

[00:15:28] [SPEAKER_01]: So with a two very different teams marketing, which was a team that was building up its brand marketing capabilities and analytics team, we together would stay called was built this organization to say.

[00:15:42] [SPEAKER_01]: Help us understand what's working, what isn't and see opportunities on the horizon that we might not see.

[00:15:48] [SPEAKER_01]: And through that we've been able to test late offices. We've been able to forecast if we make certain decisions how we expect them to perform.

[00:15:57] [SPEAKER_01]: And that just continues with every way for everyday we're marketing the data and the ability to predict and forecast continues to get better and better and better.

[00:16:07] [SPEAKER_00]: Speaking of better data, what role do you think AI is going to play really on both sides of the equation to allow I guess the seller to have a better understanding of the market dynamics before they proceed.

[00:16:19] [SPEAKER_00]: Obviously you're company to more competitively price offers to people that are selling their homes.

[00:16:24] [SPEAKER_00]: How does that entire dynamic work? And then just to be clear, you're also a seller of those homes too. You're on both sides of the marketplace. So I would imagine AI plays a big role there as well in terms of identifying prospects.

[00:16:36] [SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely. AI is being part of our pricing model and our algorithm since 2014 so it continues to grow and evolve.

[00:16:44] [SPEAKER_01]: And we kind of see it as a compiler rather than an author.

[00:16:48] [SPEAKER_01]: And so we're using it in a way that is helping us deliver an even better product to consumers.

[00:16:55] [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, the future of AI obviously everyone's talking about it. We've had the industrial age, the internet age, and now we have the AI revolution.

[00:17:04] [SPEAKER_01]: And I don't think any of us can foresee the size making change that's going to have to culture society and business.

[00:17:12] [SPEAKER_01]: But I think as far as being able to match consumers to homes and sellers and buyers together, the potentials absolutely huge.

[00:17:23] [SPEAKER_01]: We're using AI in marketing now. We're starting to use it in forecasting, we're starting to use it in our predictive model and we're using it in how we visualize and go to market.

[00:17:35] [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, talking to a lot of people about how you use it in research through AI now, you can essentially feed the consumer feedback from multiple research channels into AI.

[00:17:47] [SPEAKER_01]: Make your consumer and essentially ask that AI model to give feedback on products, marketing campaigns, you name it.

[00:17:56] [SPEAKER_01]: And right now we're running about three tests at any one time on our digital product.

[00:18:02] [SPEAKER_01]: So ensure we constantly are proving iterating and the user experience and things of that nature.

[00:18:06] [SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely.

[00:18:07] [SPEAKER_00]: And also, I think AI in the work we've done at Suzy, we've uncovered ways to just make one to one sort of contextual messaging and content.

[00:18:19] [SPEAKER_00]: Much more impactful. We've talked for so long about making things relevant yet everybody gets the same email newsletter.

[00:18:25] [SPEAKER_00]: But I think I look at your business and you want to establish that life-timination ship with a customer. I'm sure a little tease huge in terms of they sold a house to open door

[00:18:34] [SPEAKER_00]: and then you want them to sell their next house or buy their next house through a Pantoris, you have them.

[00:18:38] [SPEAKER_00]: So I would imagine that's another huge opportunity because of mining your customer data.

[00:18:43] [SPEAKER_00]: I'm packing the content that matters to them most and continuing to build that customer loyalty.

[00:18:48] [SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely. I mean, one thing on AI that I keep thinking about is just like the internet started as a search engine and then evolved into serving you the answer.

[00:18:57] [SPEAKER_01]: AI, we're kind of using as a search engine now. We're asking questions and getting responses. Over time, AI is going to know, hey Matt, I know the neighborhood you want to live in.

[00:19:09] [SPEAKER_01]: I've found a house for you. I've searched and got the best mortgage for you.

[00:19:13] [SPEAKER_01]: Say yes and it's done. Like it'll end up being in service for you. And I think the potential of that is just huge.

[00:19:21] [SPEAKER_00]: Or I know that you just had another child and the square footage per human in your house is not big enough anymore. So it's probably time to move.

[00:19:29] [SPEAKER_00]: I also know that you got a raise or you have extra money to spend or whatever it may be, so maybe you can afford this.

[00:19:36] [SPEAKER_00]: And I think a lot of people are concerned with privacy but those same people would have said that consumers that would have purchased anything online with their credit card in the year 2002.

[00:19:45] [SPEAKER_00]: So I think ultimately convenience tends to trump privacy over time because I think a lot of these privacy fears usually don't manifest to consumer harm. Obviously sometimes they do but I think most people look at their lives and say the one thing I need more of this time.

[00:20:00] [SPEAKER_00]: And there's something can save me time. I'm willing to feed data into this system, maybe sacrifice some privacy for the sake of me having a more convenient efficient life and spending my time.

[00:20:10] [SPEAKER_01]: And I think the same is probably true with AI. Yeah, we've saved privacy very seriously, but I think to your point.

[00:20:17] [SPEAKER_01]: The larger point is like something arrives at culture and it takes time for society to get used to it and open time people get more and more comfortable with things.

[00:20:26] [SPEAKER_01]: I was using chatGBT to type in and get answers. I'm now talking to it. It's how we come to St. with me and there's a point where I go, that's enough you forget you're not talking to another human because it is so real now.

[00:20:41] [SPEAKER_01]: But going back to your point about loyalty it's really interesting with a brand like open door and a business like ours because unlike if we were a candy bar or a car a candy bar loyalty could be weekly.

[00:20:55] [SPEAKER_01]: God, I could be every three years. People generally sell their house every seven to ten years. So the gap between when you're in the market or when you're next in the market is warms.

[00:21:07] [SPEAKER_01]: But every 60 seconds a homeowner asked for an offer from open door and with an 80% NPS school that allows us to kind of keep this loyalty going that people have good experiences.

[00:21:18] [SPEAKER_01]: And if you are looking for an offer now, but you're not ready to move. We're also updating our first so we will reconnect with consumers and say hey your offers change.

[00:21:28] [SPEAKER_01]: And that's how we're working it through right now. But again to your point about AI who knows where it could go in the knock-to-distant future.

[00:21:35] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I mean we were talking before the onset of the positive that we both have small children and I think what's going to be really fascinating is seeing moving forward is just how this generation, the first generation of kids who grew up with AI in the household is going to look completely differently at relationships at education at what it means to prepare for a career.

[00:21:57] [SPEAKER_00]: I mean, a gen X or like yourself like we did not grow up in the end of the house whole maybe the internet was first coming in a household when we were growing up.

[00:22:05] [SPEAKER_00]: And then you have millennials that grew up with the internet and Gen Z to grow up with a mobile device.

[00:22:09] [SPEAKER_00]: But this is a whole different paradigm that we're dealing with. And I think as a parent, as an educator, as an employer, it's just going to be fascinating to see how this all evolves.

[00:22:19] [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, because unintended consequence, a thing is ability to make decisions and reading a report about kids asking a laxer what to wear each day.

[00:22:31] [SPEAKER_01]: And on the one hand that's kind of fun and interesting but on the other is if we are not a point where society is defaulting all decisions to AI it's going to be problematic.

[00:22:42] [SPEAKER_01]: But one of the things I noticed even during COVID was how a younger generation is even talking to a laxer.

[00:22:48] [SPEAKER_01]: I remember that to avoid with my kids, Rosite, please say please and thank you to a laxer which is ridiculous because she's not real.

[00:22:55] [SPEAKER_01]: But equally, it's important to keep some social skills alive when interacting because those things then bleed into human connection and conversation.

[00:23:08] [SPEAKER_01]: So again, it's like industrial revolution, incident revolution, now the AI revolution.

[00:23:13] [SPEAKER_01]: We could talk again in five years and I think both of us will be surprised about how much has changed just because of AI.

[00:23:20] [SPEAKER_00]: We might not even have to talk maybe our avatars will do the talking for us and we could be at the beach somewhere right?

[00:23:25] [SPEAKER_01]: You're on battle.

[00:23:26] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it reminds me of that famous episode of the office where Michael Scott is played by Steve Krel and the white we're in a car and the navigation system was telling them to ride their car into the lake.

[00:23:39] [SPEAKER_00]: And Steve Krel's character saying no it has to be right.

[00:23:41] [SPEAKER_00]: The machine's always right and kind of lost ability your point to make decisions and I think that was pressure in the way in terms of where you are today where people definitely are.

[00:23:50] [SPEAKER_00]: Become a more and more reliant on this technology for better or for worse. And I think you've identified one of the opportunities to risk within this new era.

[00:23:58] [SPEAKER_01]: I always say creativity always wins and there's a new set of tools to be creative with.

[00:24:04] [SPEAKER_01]: I also think there's something great about it used to be that academic success was how reading a writing or regurgitating information.

[00:24:11] [SPEAKER_01]: Well, the reality is you don't need to know how to regurgitate information. It's all available to you and can come to it anytime.

[00:24:19] [SPEAKER_01]: Which actually I think puts more on us on creativity and strategy and innovative thinking.

[00:24:28] [SPEAKER_01]: So when I look at the kind of glass half-full with AI, I like actually this could lead to even more innovation and even more positivity in society because the focus has to go there.

[00:24:39] [SPEAKER_01]: Because all the information is available to us in an instant and soon it will just be given to us because we're curious and thinking about it. So it's an amazing time to be alive.

[00:24:51] [SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, the question becomes and I want to shift gears and wrap up here, but it's like, what is the education system going to evolve based upon that?

[00:24:59] [SPEAKER_00]: Because today kids get rewarded for memorizing stuff and regurgitating it. And the many of this is whether they truly understand it or not that drives their ability to get high test scores even with the standard eye testing, get some of the college.

[00:25:11] [SPEAKER_00]: And I agree with you 100 percent, that's not really what drives success moving forward in this new world.

[00:25:17] [SPEAKER_01]: I couldn't agree more. I mean, it's like the school systems are set up from the industrial age. It's like getting everyone to learn the same things in order to move into factories and it hasn't evolved and changed a great deal.

[00:25:32] [SPEAKER_01]: And there's colleges and teachers, obviously with applications without the CFP people are using chat to be tea in writing their essays.

[00:25:41] [SPEAKER_01]: And again, I'm with you, Matt, my question is like, why are you forcing them to work in an old way and making sure they're not using modern technology?

[00:25:51] [SPEAKER_01]: When we should actually be encouraging innovation for what's ahead. And again, it's incredibly, how slow some of these changes in education are happening.

[00:26:01] [SPEAKER_01]: It's almost like the real estate industry, right? Exactly. You know, then you'd have an open door for education.

[00:26:06] [SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely. So shifting as we wrap up here, David, it's been a great conversation.

[00:26:10] [SPEAKER_00]: Super appreciative of you taking the time. When you look back at your career and obviously you've worked at some of the most prolific mass avenue advertising agencies and now you're to really exciting prominent startup in the real estate industry,

[00:26:21] [SPEAKER_00]: what were some of the things that you think you've done right throughout your career? Some areas that you've focused on that have really helped you propel as professional to one day end up in the CMOC.

[00:26:31] [SPEAKER_01]: I think a lot of it is being authentic to yourself knowing these are my strengths, these are my weaknesses.

[00:26:38] [SPEAKER_01]: I was saying, which seems counter-intuitive. Don't spend a lot of time on your weaknesses.

[00:26:44] [SPEAKER_01]: I think going back to the educational being our data as we just talked about. I think there's a lot of focus on improving your weaknesses.

[00:26:52] [SPEAKER_01]: My sense is like, no your strengths and continue to strengthen them, no your weaknesses and build teams to cover your blind spots.

[00:27:00] [SPEAKER_01]: And then the other thing which is another crisp and thing is like the best idea is boss.

[00:27:05] [SPEAKER_01]: Work for an idea, work for the smartest store rather than a hierarchy of people and then build a culture where everyone can bring ideas.

[00:27:17] [SPEAKER_01]: I like to build small accountable teams because I find with smaller accountable teams you can run faster, you can make decisions faster,

[00:27:27] [SPEAKER_01]: and there's this pride of ownership that comes with it. So if I look back at where I've worked, I think every agency and every company has kind of taught me something new that has led from

[00:27:40] [SPEAKER_01]: taking it opportunity to move to the US when I hadn't before. I hadn't even been to the US when I took a job at Carmichael Lynch.

[00:27:48] [SPEAKER_01]: TWS, I think was about brands becoming famous and inspirational leadership, Jonathan Mildon all was the end of the year when I was at TWS London.

[00:27:58] [SPEAKER_01]: Widen Kennedy was really about how to build generational brands with Nike and crisp in as we said, that's when I started to learn how to build teams and PR as advertising.

[00:28:09] [SPEAKER_01]: Vettables was running a department, the craft of Audi and then RGA was the first time I could go from running an agency to running a network to building a strategy for innovative brands which led to the reddit five second Super Bowl.

[00:28:25] [SPEAKER_01]: All of those things together, it's not a straight path to CMO but it's naturally when you wrap it all up together.

[00:28:33] [SPEAKER_01]: It's like the natural next step is go build a brand from scratch and be directly connected to how marketing is driving the business forward and that's been the most fulfilling plum.

[00:28:44] [SPEAKER_01]: Seeing how it's impacting every day.

[00:28:47] [SPEAKER_00]: Fantastic and to wrap up your David Isir, a quote or mantra that you like to live by do you think probably sums up your career in professional strategy?

[00:28:56] [SPEAKER_01]: I love to say it's far harder to simplify than complicated.

[00:29:00] [SPEAKER_00]: Isn't that the truth they say? Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication and I agree with that wholeheartedly.

[00:29:05] [SPEAKER_00]: Well, David, thank you so much for joining today. It's been amazing hearing about your journey and I can't wait to see what's next for you and open door here in this wild market that we're in.

[00:29:14] [SPEAKER_00]: So thanks for taking the time.

[00:29:15] [SPEAKER_01]: Thanks for having me now.

[00:29:17] [SPEAKER_00]: I'll be having Susan out of the team.

[00:29:18] [SPEAKER_00]: Thanks again to David Coren, CMO of Open Door for Joining us today.

[00:29:21] [SPEAKER_00]: Be sure to subscribe, rate, review the speed of culture podcasts on your favorite podcast platform.

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[00:29:26] [SPEAKER_00]: Take care.

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